As of January 2010, this website is no longer being kept uptodate. It contains NZ Parliament debates from November 2005 to December 2009. We may resurrect the site in 2011 for the General Election.

To keep yourself uptodate with parliament, why not try following a political blog? For its excellent parliament coverage, we recommend No Right Turn.

TheyWorkForYou.co.nz is volunteer run, and has been in operation since November 2006. We developed it entirely with free and open source software, as a hint to the public sector that they should be adopting and promoting free and open source software themselves (despite what foreign corporations masquerading as a NZ ICT industry may say to the contrary).

Appropriation (Parliamentary Expenditure Validation) Bill

Third Reading

Wednesday 18 October 2006 Hansard source (external site)

CullenHon Dr MICHAEL CULLEN (Minister of Finance) Link to this

I move, That the Appropriation (Parliamentary Expenditure Validation) Bill be now read a third time. This has been an interesting and mildly lengthy debate. I think it has been to convince us that the National Party logo of the big “N” should be replaced by a big “H”, because throughout this debate National members have failed to answer some pretty important challenges.

First of all, having been challenged time after time, they refused to tell us what the leader of the National Party’s budget was spent on in the 3 months or so before the 2005 election. What was the leader’s budget spent on? Does it meet the Solicitor-General’s test of not being spent on electioneering in any shape or form, because any of it being spent on electioneering takes the whole of it outside the parliamentary processes.

The second point is that they failed to explain a whole set of details about other National Party spending. We have had all sorts of wonderful speeches. We had Murray McCully lecturing us about morality and Nick Smith lecturing us about obeying the law and the rule of law. The only man in this House who has been convicted of contempt of court lectured us at length about the rule of law. Then we had Dr the Hon Lockwood Smith forgetting to tell us certain things in a speech in which he got so carried away that he ended up calling his own previous leader, in effect, a dirty, dirty cheat. He said that expenditure on the pledge card in 1999 and 2002 was somehow cheating, forgetting completely—

CullenHon Dr MICHAEL CULLEN Link to this

Well, what is this, I ask Dr the Hon Lockwood Smith? What is it? It is a pledge advertisement from National in 2002—note the parliamentary crest—paid for by Parliamentary Service. Not, of course that Dr the Hon Lockwood Smith has been backward in coming forward in using Parliamentary Service funding. I have a photo of him near naked in the company of a number of near naked young gentlemen, and he seems to be “Mr February” on a calendar in 2002. Here he is with Miss Hibiscus Coast 2001—she is the one with the flowers. Apparently, at this stage he was so out of sorts with his colleagues that his office is actually outside the building rather than inside the building and he is sitting at his desk somewhere out on the steps of Parliament. This was all paid for by Parliamentary Service.

None of that would be legitimate under the Auditor-General’s rules because it is clearly promoting Dr the Hon Lockwood Smith and the National Party in terms of its political interest. But, of course, it is all different because it is Dr the Hon Lockwood Smith and he speaks like this: “I think you’re right.” He does that, whereas if we do it in the normal speaking fashion it is perfectly wrong and it is dirt and it is disastrous and it is cheating—

BennettPaula Bennett Link to this

Because you knowingly broke the rules.

CullenHon Dr MICHAEL CULLEN Link to this

Oh, my gosh! What was that? Oh, it was Paula Bennett. I should have realised. I thought it was Dr Nick Smith grasping himself even more firmly than usual.

Then we had the issue of the GST not being paid, and the National Party’s generous offer to pass legislation so it does not get convicted and have to pay a fine. What a generous offer that was to the House, I thought—

HughesDarren Hughes Link to this

From the chairman of the committee.

CullenHon Dr MICHAEL CULLEN Link to this

—from the chairman of the committee that introduced GST! And what is extraordinary about that, and I repeat it, is that there was no paper trail in terms of the contract for the National Party’s spending in that regard. No written arrangements were entered into and therefore the police could not work out who was responsible, and therefore nobody could be prosecuted. So it is OK, Dr Brash is off the hook anyway, so he can go and pay the money. The police cannot prosecute him. There is nothing to stop him coughing up the $118,000 right now. I am sure a quick whip-round the Exclusive Brethren, wherever they are today, would quickly pay off that $118,000.

What they would not tell us in this debate either, was the price they paid for that $1.2 million from the Exclusive Brethren. What was it? Something about banning parking in one’s neighbours’ driveways if they are not Exclusive Brethren—that sort of strange stuff that the Exclusive Brethren are into? What did Dr Brash promise? Well, I do want to place on record—because this could be quite interesting in not too many weeks’ or months’ time—that Mr Key told the House he had never met the Exclusive Brethren.

Hon Member

No, no.

CullenHon Dr MICHAEL CULLEN Link to this

Oh yes, I think Mr Key had better look at the Hansard again. He told the House he had not met the Exclusive Brethren, because I challenged him and he interjected and said he had never met them. I think he might want to change that story. He not only met them, he was deep donkey-doo in the process of organising Exclusive Brethren support—

CullenHon Dr MICHAEL CULLEN Link to this

How do we believe Dr Brash, who claimed he had never met them or discussed the pamphlet, then had to admit he did? He claimed that he had not met them, after the election, then he admitted he did. How often does Dr Brash change his story on the Exclusive Brethren? I tell Dr Brash that they are the ones where the women wear the head scarves. They are pretty easy to see.

This bill is necessary. It is necessary for two reasons. Firstly, it is necessary in order to put the public accounts in proper shape.

CullenHon Dr MICHAEL CULLEN Link to this

I am not at all sorry for not breaking the law, which is our position. Part 2 is necessary because it clarifies current spending. Just in the last 24 hours a senior member of this House—not in the Labour Party—has been told that his Christmas cards are out of order under the Auditor-General’s ruling.

BrownleeGerry Brownlee Link to this

That is rubbish.

CullenHon Dr MICHAEL CULLEN Link to this

No, it is not rubbish. That is what Mr Brownlee does not understand. He does not understand it. He says that the previous Solicitor-General is talking rubbish, except when he is condemning the Labour Party—then, of course it is absolutely true. Because the Solicitor-General said if there was any taint of electioneering, which he defined very broadly, that tainted the entire expenditure. And if members are sending out Christmas cards, and if Dr the Hon Lockwood Smith is sending out another calendar with himself near naked with another whole bunch of near naked young men—the under-21 surf club from somewhere or other—then that is clearly promoting Dr the Hon Lockwood Smith. I do not know what it is promoting him as, but it is promoting Dr the Hon Lockwood Smith, and in that case there is a taint of electioneering that disqualifies that expenditure.

If he happens to have rung anybody on his cellphone during the election campaign to discuss a problem that has been raised by that person while he was canvassing—I am sure that has happened; I bet every member of this House has rung back constituents after canvassing, using a telephone—

CullenHon Dr MICHAEL CULLEN Link to this

No, Dr Mapp does not use a telephone to ring people. He is different from most of us, as one can see from the look on his face. But most of us ring people using a telephone. I tell Dr Mapp that it is a relatively old instrument by now, so he can catch up with it if he wishes. That use of a telephone is electioneering, and that then disqualifies one’s appropriation for the use of that telephone. That is what the Auditor-General’s report implies. That is why it has to be clarified.

But the biggest doozy of all was the amendment we finally gave leave to be put, which would have meant between now and some indeterminate date when the Auditor-General finally reported back on people paying back the money, we could spend whatever we like on whatever we like because the bill provides the validation for everything from 1989 through to the passing of the bill. It was an attempt by the National Party to write a blank cheque from here on for months to come, because it was all going to be validated eventually when the Auditor-General finally reported back when the moneys had been fully refunded. That was an interesting, ill-thought-out amendment.

CullenHon Dr MICHAEL CULLEN Link to this

That was moved by Mr Simon Power.

The final thing I do need to say is that this has been a wonderful audition for all the pretenders to the National Party leadership. There is no question who won. It was Mr English. I did not agree with what he said, but he was the only one who actually hit home some hard arguments, whereas all the rest completely fluffed it. Mr English still does mock outrage better than anybody else on the National Party front bench.

BRASHDr DON BRASH (Leader of the Opposition) Link to this

In the last 24 hours we have heard Government speaker after Government speaker trying to defend the indefensible. Professor Bill Hodge of Auckland University has just made it clear that this bill tries to backdate further than any other bill in New Zealand history. He describes it as legally bad, politically bad, and morally bad. That is what he describes this bill as. What we know is that if this bill is passed, there will be no legal obligation on anybody to pay back anything. The Labour Party has said it will pay the money back. But we have seen other commitments by the Labour Party broken and broken again. Helen Clark says that Labour will try to pay it back this financial year. Well, she said that she would try to get New Zealand into the top half of the OECD in a decade. New Zealand First is even worse. It has said it will pay back what is ultimately found to be unlawful. Well, if this bill is passed this afternoon, nothing will be found to be unlawful.

We attempted to move an amendment making the effectiveness of this bill conditional upon political parties paying back what they owe. As members of this House know, we were denied the opportunity of getting that amendment through. So there will be no legal obligation at all on anybody to pay back anything if this bill is passed. Furthermore, when this bill is passed there will effectively be no limit at all on what taxpayer funds can be used for in electioneering.

This bill makes it clear that one has to ask explicitly for a vote, ask explicitly for money, or seek explicitly a party membership for one to be electioneering. The pledge card would not qualify as electioneering under that definition. Yet even Pete Hodgson made it clear that of course the pledge card was electioneering. As he said, if it had not been electioneering, Labour would have put out the card the day after the election, but it was put out before the election. The main Labour political strategist said that the pledge card was electioneering.

This bill effectively overrides the Auditor-General’s report. The Labour Party has argued that the rules are unclear. We know, from a press statement issued by Pete Hodgson himself on 14 February this year, that “the Auditor-General had met extensively with Trevor Mallard and the Prime Minister’s chief of staff in the process of drafting a report on government and parliamentary party advertising.”, in the first half of 2005. The rules were very clear, and the Labour Party knew the rules. [Interruption]

RobertsonThe ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) Link to this

I am sorry to interrupt the honourable member. I say to members on my right that Speakers’ ruling 57/3 states that interjections should be rare and reasonable. If a member wants to make a speech, then he or she can do so when the time arises.

BRASHDr DON BRASH Link to this

Pete Hodgson made it very clear in February this year that the Labour Party was properly briefed. Mr Hodgson was briefed, Mr Mallard was briefed, and the Prime Minister’s chief of staff was briefed. Labour members knew the rules, yet they flagrantly breached them.

In fact, the Labour Party has been trying to mislead the public for years. On TV last week Helen Clark said that Labour had never made any attempt to hide the fact that its pledge card was paid for by parliamentary funding. Well, in 1999 the pledge card bore no parliamentary crest, and it was associated with a brochure that said: “This card was paid for and delivered by Labour supporters.” In the vernacular, that would be called a lie. I am not going to call anyone a liar, because that would be unparliamentary.

RobertsonThe ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) Link to this

That would definitely be out of order.

BRASHDr DON BRASH Link to this

Absolutely! I am not going to do that. But that brochure clearly misled the public. Even the Opposition did not believe that Labour would stoop as low as that. It is clear that the Labour Party has been breaching the rules on parliamentary funding for years. Now that it has been found out, it is simply passing a law to make legal what has heretofore been illegal. It is cynical and self-serving. Labour stole the election by misappropriating taxpayers’ money on a grand scale.

Worse than that, Labour also breached the law by breaching the legal campaign spending cap that section 214B of the Electoral Act provides for: $2.38 million. Going into the last election the National Party was polling ahead of the Labour Party, and in the last week the Labour Party spent up big. We were puzzled by how it could spend up so big within the electoral cap. We now know that it simply ignored the electoral spending cap. Labour spent up big, in total defiance of the law. It was allowed to spend $2.38 million; we know that it spent in excess of $2.8 million, and almost certainly in excess of $3 million if the expenditure caught by the Auditor-General is correctly attributed to the Labour Party election campaign. The Labour Party stole the election by breaching not one law but two laws. It misappropriated public funds and broke the legal campaign spending limit—it simply ignored it.

Last week in the Independent newspaper, Chris Trotter made the point that the institutions of the democratic State are fragile. He took the National Party to task for holding the Labour Party to account for its breaching of the law. The Labour Party broke the law by misappropriating taxpayers’ money on a grand scale—by $800,000—and it broke the spending cap by exceeding it by at least $418,000, and almost certainly by much more. This, quite frankly, is an outrage. The assertions about GST made in this House by members of the Labour Party were outrageously dishonest—

Benson-PopeHon David Benson-Pope Link to this

Looks like a pretty black kettle to me!

BRASHDr DON BRASH Link to this

—blatantly dishonest, Mr Benson-Pope, because they bore no resemblance to the facts of the matter, at all.

I conclude by pointing out once again that the Labour Party stole the election. This is a fraudulent, illegitimate Government, and I believe that Helen Clark should go to the Governor-General, offer her resignation, and invite the Governor-General to call a new election.

MahareyHon STEVE MAHAREY (Minister of Education) Link to this

I do not know whether I am the only one in the House who noticed that this is a third reading debate. The third reading is when Opposition members who have fought their way through the dark of night and are now on their last lap come down to the House. It is when they have done themselves proud and are pumped up. Their leader comes down from his or her office and strides into the House. He or she leads the Opposition into the trenches. The leader gets up and makes a rousing address in the third reading debate, and usually what happens is that the Opposition members feel a little pumped by all that. They feel a little bit like they have done a good job. But I do not know whether I am the only one here who noticed that during that speech by Dr Don Brash it was almost like the life was being sucked out of everybody in the Chamber.

As we tried to listen to a speech made by someone who looked a little like a constipated meerkat, as he bobbed up and down and tried to get some energy into his speech, we could see the leaders-in-waiting working quietly on their own. Bill English had his head down, quietly working, bathing in the praise from Michael Cullen. Mr English was the only one to make an impact during this debate. He did his bit, he led the way, so he could quietly sit and do his work and wait for the day.

Next to Bill English, with his body turned slightly away from Bill English, was John Key, who has not done a great job in his audition over the last day and a half. He has not passed the audition. He is slightly worried at the success of Bill English in the last day and a half. On the other side of Dr Brash we have beaming Gerry Brownlee, who knows, in a way, that it does not actually matter who is leader, because he will end up OK. Gerry is acquitting himself well, as a person who does points of order and jumps up and down. He knows he will come through when Don goes.

I tell members on the Opposition side of the House—and I challenge members of the National Party to get up and deny this—that that was a life-sucking performance from the National Party’s current leader. Maurice Williamson is like a picture of what goes on in the mind of the National Party. He was sitting there thinking: “Oh my God, this man has to go.”

The reason National members really needed a good speech from Don Brash was that they have been desperate to run this issue in the last day and a half. I have sat here and wondered why they are so desperate. What is the desperation and hatred for? Why is Gerry so angry? Why has Bill taken extra lessons in being “Mr Angry”? What has been driving those members for the last day and a half? Then I thought to myself: “I know why.” [Interruption] I say to Mr Clarkson that I know why. The reason is that the last time National Party members went through this situation, they were trying to character assassinate a number of people in the House. They put extraordinary energy into it. They worked for months on it. They tried so hard to bring people down. But the tactic did not work, so that behaviour stopped. They turned round like some sort of drunk after a party and realised that all that effort had come to nothing. They had put in everything to try to assassinate people’s characters, they had made no impact on the polls at all, they still had the wrong leader, they still had no policy, they were in a position—

HenareHon Tau Henare Link to this

I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. I refer you to Standing Order 107(1), which states: “All debate must be relevant to the question before the House.” I know that the third reading is a very wide-ranging debate, but we are actually supposed to be talking about the validation legislation. Not once in the last 5 or 6 minutes have I heard that member mention anything about the bill whatsoever.

RobertsonThe ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) Link to this

I remind members that points of order are to be heard in absolute silence. That means there will be no noise. Members have been warned.

HenareHon Tau Henare Link to this

I know that it is a wide-ranging debate, so I seek some guidance from you, Mr Assistant Speaker.

RobertsonThe ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) Link to this

I thank the member for raising that point of order, and I will listen intently. I am sure Mr Maharey will come to the point.

MahareyHon STEVE MAHAREY Link to this

As I was saying about the bill, the reason National members have fought it so hard is just fear. They are now left with no issue. As a newspaper said today, now that it is clear what the Auditor-General has said, and now that it is clear that Labour will be refunding money, the air has simply gone out of the issue. No one cares. The National Party has put so much energy into this issue, but the vision has now gone. That is what we are seeing. We are seeing a National Party that knows it has to go back to arguing about the issues. It has to go back to arguing about the leadership of its own party, and that is what is causing the fear.

I will mention three things the National Party might like to do as it considers the Appropriation (Parliamentary Expenditure Validation) Bill. It might like to think about three things it could tell the country, now that this issue has gone. Firstly, it could go back to saying what is in the trust fund. Can we know what is in that trust fund? Who put money in there, how much was put in there, and what do the donators want for it? Secondly, can we finally have some truth about the Exclusive Brethren? Can we finally have that story? One man alone in this nation can tell us the full story of the Exclusive Brethren, and he needs to tell us. He needs to say on what days he met with the Brethren and what was talked about. He is sitting smiling now. He could tell us if he wants to.

Thirdly, in contrast to the issues in the validation bill that we are discussing now, Mr Brash might like to tell us about the GST. Is the cheque for $115,000 written out and ready to be passed over? There is no legal impediment whatsoever to paying that $115,000. I can tell—because I am reading Mr Maurice Williamson’s face again; as I said, he provides a picture of the thoughts in the National Party—that the National Party knows it could pay back that GST this afternoon with a little stroke of the pen, so it could validate its own behaviour over the last little while. National broke the law, and it knows that it broke the law. National members are now saying they want to pay that money back. Now that this validation bill is going through and the issues around it have sunk away to nothing, we are looking at what is like a large rock stranded on the beach. I tell Dr Brash to pay the money back.

The other thing members of the National Party might like to do is to simply be grateful. They should be grateful today to the Labour Party and other smaller parties that have worked through this issue. It helps to clear the decks for people like Katherine Rich, whom we admire on this side of the House for her straightforward talking and for the way she has dealt with Dr Brash over the last little while. We admire that kind of behaviour. The National Party should be grateful that we have stuck by the issue.

Members should forget about all the months of leaked reports, debates, posturing, and all the things that have gone on. This is the actual story. We had the election; we had the Auditor-General’s report, which was tabled last week; we have had a response from the Minister responsible, Dr Michael Cullen; and we have learnt that the Auditor-General has changed the definition of parliamentary purpose—what money can be spent for. We have learnt that even if we pay the money back—as National members like to tell us to do—that would not clean up the legal situation. We would still be acting outside the law. Therefore, the Minister responsible has indicated that we should pass validating legislation. National Party members should be grateful that that is exactly what we are doing, because that helps them and everybody else by making legal the spending back to 1989. It also means that Mr Williamson can carry on doing his duties as an MP until the other suggestion of the Minister responsible is put into place. That suggestion is for an external review group to look at how the issue will be dealt with, by the end of next year, so we can then move through the next election campaign smoothly, as we all need to.

That is why I tell National members to forget all the bluster—this issue is all over, it is done with, and we are going to settle it. I ask them to please show a little bit of gratitude that this has been done on their behalf. I know that it has been hard work for them, but I ask them to be a little grateful that we have hung in there and dealt with the issue for them.

I leave the National benches with this parting thought. After all this is over and the dust has settled, can National members please pay back the GST? It makes them look dishonest. It makes them look dishonourable. It makes them look as though they cannot be in Government because they do not tell the truth. I tell them to pay the GST back.

BrownleeGERRY BROWNLEE (Deputy Leader—National) Link to this

I ask members whether they have noticed that neither of the last two speakers attempted to offer any justification for this legislation at all.

KingHon Annette King Link to this

That’s right, Don didn’t. He didn’t even in the last two speeches.

BrownleeGERRY BROWNLEE Link to this

Well, the last two Labour speakers, to make it clear.

KingHon Annette King Link to this

You said the last two speakers!

BrownleeGERRY BROWNLEE Link to this

Well, most certainly, the Leader of the Opposition is not going to be justifying this legislation, I say to Ms King. She can sit over there, laughing all she likes, but the reality is that nobody in the Labour Party wants to be on the record justifying the indefensible—the denial of corruption that this bill represents. There is no other way of looking at this whole situation.

Initially, it was all about the pledge card. It got expanded into a whole lot of other things like the Labour Party members putting out pamphlets with candidates on them, and various other sorts of things. But essentially it is about the pledge card. The Labour members always knew that they would have a problem with it—the Auditor-General told them, the Chief Electoral Officer told them, and their own auditors told them. But they sat up on the ninth floor of the Beehive and said that they would do it anyway. They said that they would dip into taxpayers’ funding, pay for that pledge card out of taxpayers’ funds, and hoped they would get away with it. That was the plan—a plan to deceive the people of New Zealand.

That is, of itself, an action that one could say lends itself towards corruption. But the true corruption was that they knew that if they did this, they would breach the electoral cap and they would breach section 214B of the Electoral Act, because they knew that they were overspending. So there are two crimes here: one is that the Labour Party stole taxpayers’ money, the second is that the Labour Party chose to knowingly breach the Electoral Act and spend more than they should. That is described as a corrupt practice. No one on the Labour side of the House wants to have a Hansard record that shows him or her justifying that action.

So we had Michael Cullen coming into the House today saying: “Why aren’t you all grateful for what we are doing, because this is a plague on all our houses? The Auditor-General has come down hard on every one of us.” That is wrong. The Auditor-General looked at a snapshot of advertising during the election because it was pointed out to him that the pledge card had to have been paid for from taxpayer funds, and he found that to be wrong. As he investigated further, he found another $400,000 to $500,000 worth of breach on the part of the Labour Party.

People need to be aware of how this worked. Every one of us in this House was required to supply to the Auditor-General all of the advertising, all of the information, and all of the other activity paid for by the Parliamentary Service in that specific 3-month time frame, and he tells us in his report that he went through all of it page by page. He found that some parties had committed minor breaches, but he found the overwhelming amount of fraud, of corruption, and of theft was committed by the Labour Party. That is why we have this report in front of us.

So there are two things. There is the issue of whether they should pay it back and whether they should pay interest to the taxpayer. The answer is yes. There are thousands of New Zealanders today who are a day or two behind on their tax payments, and they will pay interest on that. They will pay penalty interest at a high rate. If Labour were to pay penalty interest today on the 14 months it has had this money available to it, it would add another $150,000 to its bill, topping a million dollars robbed off the taxpayer. I simply ask the Labour members why they cannot treat themselves the way they treat other New Zealanders.

We have been told that without this legislation today parliamentarians are virtually shut down and cannot operate. Dr Cullen gave the ridiculous example of members of a party in here being told by the Parliamentary Service that they cannot send out Christmas cards this year. The absurdity is that if they chose to send a stamped letter to each of their constituents, there would be no problem. If they chose to put “Merry Christmas” on that letter somewhere, that would be no problem. But Dr Cullen asserts that sending out a card—something that in the corporate world is quite normal, and MPs will find that out through their letterboxes in the coming weeks—is outside the law. Utter rubbish! Dr Cullen would also make an argument that everyone in this House today will have to ask the Parliamentary Service whether it is OK to travel home at its expense tomorrow. Let me tell Dr Cullen that members of Parliament, properly elected, have rights and we are not about to trade those rights away to make their very big wrong seem a little bit less than it is.

So I am disappointed that the amendments put forward by the National Party—the idea that there should be a date by which the Labour Party pays back, by which New Zealand First pays back, and by which all other parties that are required to pay back would do so—which would have given this bill a little more substance, were not accepted. But Labour members do not want that because they think that over the passage of time this legislation will be forgotten, and if anybody brings up the pledge card, they will say: “Oh, no, no, go and have a look, it was legal.”, because that is what this legislation does. It lets them off the hook, and it also is a misuse of Parliament. It is an abuse of the trust that we have as parliamentarians sent here to be leaders in the country, and it is a reason why New Zealanders are turning away from the Labour Party in their droves.

We have seen over and over this Government putting itself above the law, considering that if it does it, it is OK. Sometimes we struggle to understand that thinking. Dr Brash mentioned the justifications put out by Chris Trotter, that well-known left-leaning commentator. He put out a piece a few weeks ago that said that Labour took the money from the taxpayers, it overspent on the electoral cap, and thank goodness it did it because otherwise we might have had a National Government. If we are going to have a Government that says the ends justify the means, then we are giving away all of our democratic rights and we are allowing Helen Clark to establish herself as some sort of potentate dictator, which is totally unacceptable in a country like this.

So when Dr Cullen says that too many members over here are outraged, he is wrong—not enough members in this House are outraged. Some of us sit in our electorate offices several times a week listening to the concerns of New Zealanders—people who have real troubles in their lives. They are people who need operations, people who are not getting the extra help they need at school, people who have issues with various Government departments, and people who are trying to do things in the economy but find massive brakes in their way. We listen to those people, we hear what they say, and we know that a Government that wants this country to make progress would focus on those things. But, no, this week the brakes go on, everything gets stopped, everything gets pushed aside, and the Labour Government chooses to throw Parliament into urgency to get itself out of trouble, to try to manage a political issue.

As the Prime Minister said on Monday: “We are moving on.” As the previous speaker said: “We are moving on.” I think it is time the Labour Government moved on, and I think the people of New Zealand will be giving it that message loud and clear in the months ahead. This legislation is in place to cover corruption, to cover bad practice, and to cover the theft the Labour Party perpetrated on the people of New Zealand.

O'ConnorHon DAMIEN O'CONNOR (Minister of Corrections) Link to this

I would like to take the brief time I have to put a few facts on the table, because I think the public will be somewhat confused if they have just turned on the radio and listened to the National members. This validation bill, as my colleague said, allows us, following its passage, to clear the decks and clarify some of the rules around the spending of the Parliamentary Service money that comes to each and every MP in this House. I do not want to go back too far and try to rewrite history, as the National Party has been doing, but I think it is important to put a few facts on the table.

This Appropriation (Parliamentary Validation Expenditure) Bill validates spending by every party in this Parliament, including the National Party. It validates spending by every party except the Progressives. Its passage is necessary, for legal issues, to allow us to move on.

I find it strange because Mr Brownlee was educated at the same school as I was and he has been brought up in the same religion as me, and I would have expected him to have the same principles and understanding of what is the truth. He should be able to understand the facts and understand what he is obliged to do. In spite of his being a Catholic and being able to go to confession and seek absolution, the reality is that he should tell the truth. The truth is that the National Party spent money deemed by the Auditor-General to be outside the legal appropriations.

The National Party has been saying right throughout this debate that it did not sin, and that it is clearer, cleaner, and whiter than the driven snow. National members say they did not sin. That might be an expression used by their funders—“We did not sin.”—but the reality is that if mistakes are made, big or small, sometimes we call them a sin.

Mr Brownlee may seek absolution through confession. It will not remove the reality that the National Party spent $11,305. It spent that money in the same way that the Labour Party spent $800,000. We did not have access to a leaked report from the Auditor-General. The National Party did, and it rushed to pay back the money in order to seek absolution—probably guided by Mr Brownlee in the hope that his confession might remove the reality that he had sinned. But if the Auditor-General deems the money was spent illegally, then Gerry Brownlee did sin.

This bill seeks to validate the spending by National, Labour, New Zealand First, the Greens, United Future, and ACT. Each and every one of the parties in this House spent money in a misunderstanding of the rules around the appropriation.

If the National Party was so much smarter and understood the rules clearly, why then did it get it wrong with its GST payment? Why has it refused to pay back $118,000 in GST? National members think that they were so smart and knew the rules—or maybe they knew something else. Maybe they knew that they did not need to spend money through the Parliamentary Service appropriation. Maybe they knew that they had secret backers.

The question is what they would have done for the $1.2 million spent by the Exclusive Brethren backers of the National Party to offset the money other parties spent by way of the Parliamentary Service appropriation. It is the question that I have had to ask through this whole debate. Maybe the National Party, when we pass this bill, will be able to move on and explain. Maybe it will pay back the $118,000 worth of GST it owes, explain to us what it did for its $1.2 million, explain to us how a group that says it prays for the Government—and that would obviously pay for a Government—

TuriaTariana Turia Link to this

I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. I am just not clear whether we are talking about the bill or about the National Party.

RobertsonThe ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) Link to this

Thank you. I have actually indicated to the member about coming back to the bill, and I am sure he will come to the point.

O'ConnorHon DAMIEN O'CONNOR Link to this

I apologise, but it has just been very hard to try to understand what the National Party has been talking about through the debate on this bill.

This bill validates spending that every party—including the Māori Party—understood to be legitimate and to be legal throughout the campaign before the last election. I think it raises as many questions as it answers. It is a technical bill; it will allow us to move on and to ask questions about what legitimate parliamentary work is. The members opposite, especially those who are constituent MPs, will know that one has obligations to one’s constituency. There are costs in providing services as an MP and there are obligations to go out and tell people what is factually going on in Parliament—unlike the campaigns run by the National Party.

The questions I have to ask go back to previous spending, prior to the last election. I was rather sad that the Auditor-General did not choose to go back and analyse spending going right back into the 1980s, where there has been acknowledged expenditure by many parties that we would claim to be very, very similar in its application. I think we have every right, once this bill passes through the House, to put the heat on the National Party, and I am sure that Bill English, when he gets up to speak, will probably explain what the National Party will do to pay back its GST. It has not been validated through this bill and, as my colleague says, if National Party members were that smart, how come they spent over $11,000 illegally? Was that figure inclusive of GST? The other question, given National’s righteous claims over interest, is whether National offered to pay interest on its $11,000 when it was so quick to pay back money after the leaked report.

We need to ask questions around how the National Party gained access to a leaked report. Why those members did not need to spend a large part of their parliamentary budget through this process is another question I would like to have answered. I see the guilt on the faces of those members opposite with regard to the payment made by a party outside Parliament—the Exclusive Brethren. Lockwood Smith looks a little unsure about that. Those questions must be answered by the National Party as we move forward from the passage of this legislation, which is necessary in this Parliament.

I welcome the passage of the bill. It will allow Parliament to move on and to clarify the rules around parliamentary spending and around the use of any parliamentary money prior to an election.

TuriaTARIANA TURIA (Co-Leader—Māori Party) Link to this

There is a lesson in all of this for all of us. Mr Brady was doing his job, which was to point out the need for tight controls in order to establish the legal legitimacy, let alone any moral authority, of Government and Parliament. This concept of doing the job is something that has resonated throughout the debate. We in the Māori Party have been very keen to learn the ropes—mahia te mahi. We understand the importance of the rules. We know that it is expected of us if we are to be the best representatives we can be for our constituency. The best is to act with honesty and integrity and to uphold the notion of collective responsibility—that we must all take ownership of our performance, our practice, and our behaviours. Collective ownership—the ability to think of the good of the team, over and above the individual impact—brings with it additional obligations and responsibilities.

I acknowledge that the concept of collective responsibility is hurting many MPs today, who are now in the position of paying for mistakes that they may not have played a part in. The cost of making mistakes is far less for the Māori Party in terms of dollars and cents, but like the other parties in this House, we made a mistake. We stand here today knowing that with the exception of the Progressives, no matter the amount involved, there has been a misuse of public money by all parties of this Parliament, including ourselves. We do not need to point the finger at each other, or add further to what one paper called our “day of shame”. No one is absolved of blame. Indeed, I recall the words: “Let he who is without sin cast the first stone.”

Having an eye to history, however, means we can learn from our past and ensure we never go down that road again. If there is one clear outcome from the Auditor-General’s report, it is the hope that we all, as a Parliament, be focused on our application of parliamentary purposes. There is a greater waste of public money on a daily basis when the public and those of us in this Chamber are subject to the constant free-for-all erupting in the House—the name-calling, MPs being labelled a bunch of fruit cakes, a pack of crooks—and the general bluff and bluster that some people erroneously perceive as doing the job of an MP. We have had days, weeks, and months of abusive tirades and accusations of corruption, profiteering, leadership crises, and stolen elections, and now reports that confirm illegal activity, unlawfulness of parliamentary spending, and inappropriate and misappropriated expenditure.

It seems to have been a contest of wits. Who can call each other the worst names? Whose crime is the greatest? The debate has at times bordered on desperation—an air of hysteria is apparent as politicians scramble to denigrate each other. There is no reason why the value of robust debate has to be sacrificed by the constant barrage of personal abuse.

This whole issue has been about protocols, processes, and rules. We knew from day one that members must not use parliamentary resources to solicit money, votes, or membership. We also knew that as a Māori party we would be under higher scrutiny than the others, because this is our experience in the community. We have to be twice as good and twice as clean as others. We have been generally appreciative of the clear guidance we received from Parliamentary Service, the Members Services Committee, finance, and the parliamentary staff, who work so hard to create an environment that engenders respect. I would hasten to suggest that the rules of the job simply require some common sense.

My colleague Mr Harawira referred yesterday to the description from the Clerk of the House, who defined the role of members as encompassing “a considerable amount of legal freedom”. With freedom comes responsibility, and with responsibility comes discipline. A critical issue that has arisen as a result of this whole debacle has been the recommendation that Parliamentary Service will be required to immediately institute controls and processes to pre-approve expenditure. Dr Cullen himself has stated that this is to be a “significant change from current practice”.

This is one of the most critical issues in this legislation, and it is central to our opposition to the bill. The proposed changes raise a raft of constitutional questions around the very way in which democracy will work. Who will decide what expenditure is to be approved, and who will police the processes to make the critical judgments about what is a parliamentary purpose and what is electioneering? It is being said that the Controller and Auditor General’s view threatens long-established conventions on how we do the job of an MP. I want to make it explicitly clear that the Māori Party absolutely supports the need to be accountable, and to be seen to be exercising responsibility in our use of the public purse. It is essential that we restore the public confidence in this regard.

But respect does not flow on as a consequence of prescriptive rules; it follows from the proper exercise of responsibility—of kaitiakitanga. The high standards we follow in working within the legal freedom of an MP’s role must be balanced by the application of common sense. I want to raise the issue today that although Labour has been the party most under the spotlight with this legislation, all parties in this House are equally open to scrutiny that may be defined as unlawful, whether or not we were aware of it at the time. The key issue for moving forward as an MMP Parliament is that we must all take ownership and all participate in the process of a broader solution. If we are all part of the problem, then let us all also be part of the answer. If there are to be significant changes, they must be signed up to equally by all the political parties, regardless of size.

As the debate raged on, last night, I came across a letter from the Congregational Leaders Conference of Aotearoa, which represents the Catholic religious brothers, priests, and sisters of our country. I want to share their comments, because there is a message inherent in their words that we should all consider: “We prize and respect our democracy and the values that underpin it. At this time we wish to express our distaste at recent events in the political arena. Not only are the character assassinations, innuendo, details of the private lives of politicians etc causing untold personal distress to politicians and their families, they also bring our democratic process into disrepute and are a misuse of taxpayers money”.

It is no wonder that the faith of congregational leaders has been sorely tested. But all is not lost. I recall the advice of Te Ururoa Flavell in the first reading debate to move from a situation of paybacks—revenge and punishments—to a philosophy of pay forwards, which means investing in our future. We need to invest in honesty, integrity, and accountability. I welcomed the words of Gordon Copeland last night in explaining that United Future would pay back its debt because it was a question of public perception and moral judgment. These sentiments were also expressed yesterday by the Greens co-leader Jeanette Fitzsimons, who described the obligation as a moral one—as did Metiria Turei this morning—to do the right thing because it is the right thing to do.

We need to pay forward with consistent moral standards, upholding best practice, and abiding by the rules in pursuit of kotahitanga. We also need to value the capacity of the public service to deliver free and frank advice, and we should demonstrate the maturity to consider the advice in the spirit in which it is given. The Māori Party wants to be part of a Parliament that New Zealanders can indeed look at with admiration, so that they can tell us that they prize and respect our democracy and the values that underpin it. At this time of such turmoil and disrepute, we need to invest in a Parliament that can, once again, earn back the respect of the people whom we are elected to represent—a Parliament not for politicians or for the public purse but a Parliament for the people, doing the job in the best way we can.

LockeKEITH LOCKE (Green) Link to this

I rise on behalf of the Green Party to follow up on what our co-leader Jeanette Fitzsimons said in the first reading debate. We will be abstaining on the Appropriation (Parliamentary Expenditure Validation) Bill, and I want to explain briefly why. It is for two reasons. The first reason is in terms of the content of the bill itself. The bill has many good points that help in looking forward and the process of clarifying what is appropriate expenditure on MPs’ parliamentary business. But we are also concerned that the bill as it stands may convey the impression and the feeling that MPs can relieve themselves of the responsibility for spending money inappropriately. The Auditor-General, as the referee, has determined that that is the case, and we do have respect for his office in this parliamentary system in our system of government, whether he is right or wrong or whether or not some of the expenditure was misspent. In our case some of the money was wrongly spent, but in some cases, of course, we challenged that finding.

We will also be abstaining because we have a confidence and supply agreement with the Labour Party in Government, and that is an agreement to abstain on motions deemed to be those of confidence and supply—which this one has been defined as. I would like to point out quite clearly that the Green Party will be repaying every cent of the money deemed by the Auditor-General to be inappropriately spent. It is not easy for the Green Party, as a small party with six MPs in Parliament, to do so, just as it is not easy for some of the other parties to do so. But we will do our duty in that respect. We will keep our faith with the process.

We will also be working constructively with other parties in this House to clearly refine the laws on MPs’ expenditure—what parliamentary business actually is, etc., etc.—because the report of the Auditor-General has put all MPs in the very uncomfortable and untenable position of not really knowing what is acceptable and what is unacceptable at any point in the electoral cycle. It is particularly problematic for small parties that are mainly made up of list MPs. For instance, in one of my own portfolios I am the foreign affairs spokesperson for the Green Party. Most of the subjects I speak on, like North Korean nuclear tests, have nothing to do with legislation in this House, but those subjects are just as important for the people of New Zealand and the people of the world, in both a political and a parliamentary sense. So the Green Party, in promoting the Green attitude on North Korean nuclear testing—on which we have been very critical and on which we have tried to put forward some constructive solutions—deems that very much to be parliamentary business. Also, of course, I in my role and other Green MPs in their roles want to get our views out to as many New Zealanders as possible—to all New Zealanders, if we can—so there should not be any restraint on our ability to do that in terms of it being deemed to be a parliamentary purpose.

So these are the sorts of things that we want to clarify as the discussions continue with the Parliamentary Service Commission, the parties, and the Speaker, and with proper legal advice as we go through. The Green Party will be very much a part of that process.

We also hope there will be a much clearer definition not only of what is appropriate for election spending but also of money coming into the coffers of political parties for the financing of elections. We want a very clear definition in order to get away from these big anonymous donations, which can skew the electoral process. In a number of respects, problems have been identified with large anonymous donations and the way they are put into trust accounts—particularly by donors to the National Party. Third-party spending is also quite a vexed question. We do not want to stop groups outside political parties from engaging in the democratic process, but we do not want it to be a cover for parties to in fact lift their spending caps through third-party campaigns and donations. So we want to be part of the process of defining that matter.

This whole issue has been very difficult for all of the parties, but, in another way, we should look on the positive side. It has forced us to grapple with the issue of parliamentary spending, to grapple with our accountability to the public of New Zealand, and to grapple with election financing by parties and third parties. With that positive perspective, the Green Party abstains from voting on this bill.

CopelandGORDON COPELAND (United Future) Link to this

The Auditor-General, as is well known, decided that some expenditure by United Future in the 2005 election was electioneering expenditure, and he therefore concluded that that expenditure was unlawful. He did not say it was criminal and he did not say it was illegal. The word that he used was “unlawful”. Anyone in this House, as has happened in this debate, who claims that this expenditure was criminal and that it represented thievery is simply guilty of politically motivated slander. That is the simple truth. Anyone who says the expenditure was illegal is plainly wrong. The correct term is that it was “unlawful”.

Madam Speaker’s report to the House stated that “reimbursement is not legally necessary”. She went on to say, however, that reimbursement “must be considered seriously if public confidence in the Parliament is to be maintained.” United Future took those words—and, I would suggest, that challenge—from Madam Speaker very seriously indeed, because this is a very serious matter. We gave serious consideration therefore—as we were asked to do—to the whole question of whether we should repay the money deemed by the Auditor-General to have been unlawfully spent. Accordingly, we made a public declaration that we will repay the amount deemed to have been unlawfully spent.

I need to say that reimbursement comes at great personal financial cost to our small team of three MPs. I did the numbers and probably, on a per capita basis, the greatest cost will lie with the New Zealand First MPs, and we are No. 2. Why? Because we had eight people in Parliament when the money was spent, and now we are only three. Nevertheless, we are determined on that course of action because it is the right thing to do. I must say that for me personally it is not an enjoyable experience. But at least I have a clear conscience, in relation to any wrongdoing on my part or on the part of my party.

United Future acted in good faith throughout the 2005 election, and we carefully considered every expenditure we undertook, as to whether it fell within what we understood clearly to be the rules. Those rules have been substantially unaltered since 1989—hence this validating legislation goes back to that date. We asked Parliamentary Service—pretty much on a case by case basis, ahead of committing the expenditure—whether it deemed that the expenditure fell within the rules. The Auditor-General himself conceded to United Future’s leader, the Hon Peter Dunne, that at least our party—I am not speaking for others—acted in good faith throughout. That is very important to me; it is very important to United Future. To break the law inadvertently is one thing; to break the law deliberately is quite a different matter. There is a huge moral difference between those two situations.

We are also, as is well known, voting to validate the unlawful expenditure. We are doing that because, firstly, Treasury advised that we need to do it in terms of the Public Finance Act 1989, and, secondly, because it is part of our confidence and supply agreement with the Labour-led Government. It is a supply matter, it is a budgetary matter, and it is part of the budgetary cycle. Let me tell the House that United Future keeps its word. We are keeping our word with the Labour Government. If it turns out that, in 2008, we are working with another party, such as National, we will keep our word then, as well.

So we now come to the third reading of the legislation that will pass today to validate this unlawful expenditure. We now have the challenge before us as a Parliament to come together—well before the sunset date of 31 December 2007—and sort out the rules that are going to apply for the future, particularly for the 2008 elections, in terms of what is, and what is not, lawful electioneering expenditure. That is the challenge now placed before this House.

I agree with Madam Speaker, Tariana Turia, and other people, who correctly point out that public confidence in this institution has been badly shaken. We have to work across parties on a fully consensual basis, if we are to see that public confidence restored. I do not think any party in this House is free of blame in terms of the erosion of public confidence. Yes, the facts as I have outlined them are what they are, but it does not do the process any good, either, if, for political gain, people exaggerate the situation, cry “criminality” when none is involved, and cry “thievery” when none is involved, particularly in situations when they know perfectly well in the heart of their own conscience that they did exactly the same thing in previous elections. That is not debatable; that is simply factual.

It is time we moved away from that situation, because we are talking here about public confidence in this institution. This Parliament has had a proud tradition for 152 years. We are judged—in all the polls—to be the second-least corrupt nation on the Earth, next to Iceland. We have never, in 152 years, had a serious corruption scandal in this Parliament, to my knowledge. We have never had fisticuffs. We have never had a coup. I would say that we can lay claim to be the world’s oldest democracy, because we gave the vote to the tangata whenua in 1867 and to women in 1893. We were therefore the first nation in the world to have universal franchise. We have a lot to be proud of.

In summary, United Future has acted honestly and openly throughout this process. We have faced the need to repay the money that was unlawfully spent, even though we acted in good faith. Here we stand. We can do no more.

RoyHEATHER ROY (Deputy Leader—ACT) Link to this

I stand to speak on the third reading of the Appropriation (Parliamentary Expenditure Validation) Bill. Few things have generated as much media coverage as this issue. We should not lose track of the principle that lies behind it. We should be aware of the perversion of democracy that is taking place here today. A good Government is one that can win a battle of ideas. A bad Government forces through its dictates at all cost. Kiwis should have no doubt what kind of Government is facing us today. Societies become less democratic when their Governments become less transparent, less accountable to the public they are supposed to serve, and make laws for their own preservation.

Today this Parliament is passing, without any public consultation, retrospective law to validate Parliament’s own spending. There will be no sending this bill to a select committee and no chance for the public to submit their opinions. As we opened our newspapers or turned on our televisions this morning we saw the crisis of confidence that is developing for Parliament and the Government in this country. This bill might pass a confidence and supply vote in this House, but Kiwi communities have no confidence in the politicians who pass it. No individual citizen and no company is in a position to change a law to suit itself. The Labour Party can, and is. Smaller parties frequently find themselves excluded from decisions, and often from parliamentary debates. Some MPs have hardly said a word in this House since their maiden speech. Government departments pay off whistleblowers to keep them quiet. Public servants are fired or suspended for asking questions that are unpopular or for speaking out.

Since last year’s election we have seen heavy-handed select committee chairmen tear up letters from committee members who raise serious concerns. For the first time in 103 years a Crown-owned company has been fined for contempt of Parliament. In 2003 the Government suspended an electoral law so that a Labour MP who had sworn allegiance to another country did not lose his seat or his salary. Again, this was done under urgency.

DuynhovenHon Harry Duynhoven Link to this

I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. I assume the member speaking is referring to the difficulty I had when I wrote to the then Privileges Committee chair in relation to an issue that arose over citizenship. She is quite incorrect in saying that I had sworn allegiance to another country. I take that to be greatly offensive, and ask her to withdraw that comment.

RobertsonThe ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) Link to this

The member has taken offence.

RoyHEATHER ROY Link to this

I withdraw that comment. In 2003 the Government introduced legislation for a particular Labour MP. Again, this was done under urgency so that the public were denied the chance to comment, and again the legislation was retrospective—Parliament moving back in time to cover the butt of a Government member of Parliament. Now this bill excuses parties from misspending public money.

How can we expect other New Zealanders to follow the rules made in this House when our Government refuses to live by the rules, then changes the law to suit itself? How can we expect our Parliament and our democracy to be respected when we push through self-serving bills under urgency to protect ourselves? I admit that ACT did not escape scrutiny in the Auditor-General’s report. Rodney Hide and I have paid our personal cheques to right the wrong that the Auditor-General found. We thought we had done everything correctly. We did what we thought we had to, to work within the rules. It hurts that despite our best efforts we were found to have spent money wrongly. We have repaid the Parliamentary Service from our own pockets, not those of our members.

It is true that without this bill politicians would have to be much more careful about how we spend public money. But that would be much better than using our special privilege to stand here today and ram through a bill that the public have not had the chance to read, have not been able to comment on, and do not want. They have made that very clear. The Auditor-General’s report has demonstrated why we need limits on the power of politicians: because otherwise they will use their power for political advantage, at the expense of taxpayers.

People are saying that the Government’s response to this bill takes New Zealand closer to a banana republic and it raises serious questions of credibility for the parties supporting it here today. How can any party come to this House and talk about strengthening core institutions, when its members vote for a bill that undermines the rule of law? How can they discuss the behaviour of politicians, when they are willing to push through a bill that validates the wrongful acts of their own MPs? How can they talk about the breakdown of law, when they are terrified at the very idea of a transparent democracy?

ACT members stand against this big, powerful, privileged Government. We are opposed to politicians who change the law to suit themselves. We want a Government that people can trust and that trusts the people. We have never fought to defend privilege or take what belongs to others. We will not be turning on that record today, here in this House. Democracy requires more than the relentless pursuit of power. A genuinely democratic Government consults its people and governs in an open and accountable way. This bill defies the rule of law. It has not been subject to public submissions and it is out of place in any liberal democracy. That is why ACT stands here today and opposes this bill.

BrownPETER BROWN (Deputy Leader—NZ First) Link to this

I found that that was an unusual contribution from a member of a party whose leader for 12 weeks went dancing in fancy frilly shirts, whilst she spent some weeks wearing camouflage—and it was all at the taxpayers’ expense.

DuynhovenHon Harry Duynhoven Link to this

And who else pays Rodney?

BrownPETER BROWN Link to this

That is a good question, and I am not going to answer it; the Speaker wants me to come back to the bill.

New Zealand First supports this bill for three major reasons. First of all, the Auditor-General recommends we have such legislation. The Auditor-General, in the very report we are all referring to, recommends that there is such legislation.

BrownPETER BROWN Link to this

The honourable member should start reading the thing. I tell the member to read page 53.

SmithHon Dr Nick Smith Link to this

Where does he support this legislation?

BrownPETER BROWN Link to this

There is a little bit more reading for the member, then. He should read the Speaker’s report and see what she has to say. She suggests that we need this sort of legislation. Finally, if the member is not convinced—if he can read—

DuynhovenHon Harry Duynhoven Link to this

I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. I do apologise for interrupting my colleague, who is being fairly severely interrupted by the National front bench, but a very unparliamentary comment was just made by Dr Nick Smith about the Speaker and I think he should be asked to withdraw and apologise.

RobertsonThe ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) Link to this

I did not hear it, but if Dr Smith made a derogatory comment I ask him to withdraw it.

SmithHon Dr Nick Smith Link to this

I withdraw. I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. Was it appropriate for Mr Peter Brown to bring the Speaker into the debate?

RobertsonThe ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) Link to this

No, it was not.

SmithHon Dr Nick Smith Link to this

Well, can you make him withdraw and apologise, too?

RobertsonThe ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) Link to this

Would the member please be seated. If the member brought the Speaker into the debate, then he should not do so. I ask the member now to continue his speech.

BrownPETER BROWN Link to this

I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. I brought the Speaker into the debate insomuch as she has written a report we have all read, or at least members on this side have. I think I am entitled to refer to the Speaker’s report on this very issue.

RobertsonThe ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) Link to this

Thank you, Mr Brown. You are entitled to do so. Please continue your speech.

BrownPETER BROWN Link to this

I reiterate what I said. We are supporting this bill because the Auditor-General himself, the Speaker, and Treasury in its reports to Cabinet, all recommend that we have such legislation.

New Zealand First has been accused of overspending in the same way that National members have been accused of overspending. Allegedly, the National Party has written a cheque and paid its so-called debt. National had the advantage that the Auditor-General had a talk to the leader of the party and warned him what was likely to happen. The Auditor-General did not do that for New Zealand First—I do not know which other parties he actually went and spoke with, but he did not do so with New Zealand First. Don Brash, on the radio, said exactly that. The Auditor-General did not even go and speak with the Parliamentary Service, but he spoke with the National Party. National overspent, despite being warned and despite being advised. We can claim that we overspent without being warned and without being advised.

But the matter is more serious than that. In his report, the Auditor-General makes a recommendation that the Parliamentary Service should be the authority that agrees or disagrees with a particular item of expense. Indeed, the report states at paragraph 6.20 on page 53: “I also recommend that the Service, in consultation with the Minister responsible for Vote: Parliamentary Service, take urgent measures to ensure that advertising expenditure incurred under the Party and Member Support appropriations is for a purpose within the scope of those appropriations. These measures should include: Revising the guidance given to MPs on advertising to provide clear instruction about what advertising costs can be incurred under the Party and Member Support appropriations.”

I will not read on, but the fact that the Auditor-General says that clear instructions should be provided implies that the current instructions are less than clear. In other words, they are open to some form of interpretation.

BrownPETER BROWN Link to this

They might well be open to abuse—the member would know more about that than me.

New Zealand First was exceedingly cautious in the election. We went and sought guidance and sign-off from the Parliamentary Service—the body that the Auditor-General recommends should have that sort of authority. We went and asked the Parliamentary Service, and we got sign-off. But we went further than that. We went to the Electoral Commission and got our materials signed off. There may have been some small rats and mice stuff that we did in-house, but we got sign-off for the vast bulk of what we produced at election time from the Parliamentary Service and the Electoral Commission. Taking into account the fact that the Auditor-General says there needs to be clear instructions, and the fact that the rules can be interpreted one way or the other, we are saying that we want an opinion that states consistently what the rules are.

SmithHon Dr Nick Smith Link to this

What’s wrong with the Auditor-General?

BrownPETER BROWN Link to this

We have not said we will not obey or follow the rules that the Auditor-General has stipulated; we have said—and I want to make this explicitly clear—that New Zealand First will pay any moneys it rightfully and lawfully owes. But we reserve the right to be convinced that they are rightfully and lawfully owed.

I have heard other parties saying they will pay anything, everything, and everybody. Let me say to those members that party funds come from people who run raffles and sell raffle tickets. They come from people who hold—

HeatleyPhil Heatley Link to this

That’s no justification for breaking the law.

BrownPETER BROWN Link to this

There is no breaking the law. The member should read the report. He should shut his mouth and read the report.

We will not pay 1c that we are not obliged to pay—not 1c—but we will pay everything once we are convinced that everything needs to be paid. And we will not treat our party people with contempt. Those members opposite may well dig deep into the party pockets of people who go out and sell raffle tickets on their behalf, but we have an obligation to look after the people who support us, and we will do that.

This report opens the door for all sorts of problem areas, and that matter was well canvassed at the Parliamentary Service Commission this morning. We need to bring in this legislation, and with some urgency. As members well know—or they might not know—the Parliamentary Service only yesterday vetoed having Christmas cards financed from parties’ budgets. I do not think that the members opposite know that, but they are in danger of having to fork out to pay for their Christmas cards if this legislation does not go through. The Auditor-General has told ACT—and the ACT member speaking this morning raised this matter—that he has not turned his mind to MPs’ travel costs when they are engaged in going about their business. It could well be that we will all be caught with travel costs. Every National and ACT MP, and indeed every MP in this House, who wants to vote against this legislation should take note of that. This legislation is required so that all of us—all MPs—can do our jobs properly.

DuynhovenHon HARRY DUYNHOVEN (Minister for Transport Safety) Link to this

I seek leave to make a personal explanation in light of the comments made by the ACT member Heather Roy, who preceded Mr Brown in speaking.

RobertsonThe ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) Link to this

In connection with what?

DuynhovenHon HARRY DUYNHOVEN Link to this

To do with matters regarding citizenship that were raised in the House and were the subject of legislation. It is quite clear that the House does not understand what happened and why.

RobertsonThe ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) Link to this

The member has asked for leave to make a personal explanation. Is there any objection—

RoyHeather Roy Link to this

I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker—

RobertsonThe ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) Link to this

I have a point of order on the floor at the moment. Is there any objection to that course of action being taken? There is objection.

DuynhovenHon Harry Duynhoven Link to this

You are a disgrace, Nick Smith—an absolute disgrace.

SmithHon Dr Nick Smith Link to this

You’re the one who had retrospective legislation twice.

EnglishHon BILL ENGLISH (National—Clutha-Southland) Link to this

Yes, this is Harry’s second time! Let us just come right back to what lies at the heart of this debate and this legislation. What lies at its heart was a deliberate action taken by senior figures in the Labour Party in order to spend, during an election campaign, half a million dollars of taxpayers’ money on a pledge card that—as Dr Brash pointed out—broke two rules: the rules of this House, in respect of the appropriation of parliamentary money; and the Electoral Act, in respect of the cap on expenditure on an election.

The Labour Party has not answered one simple question right through this debate: was the pledge card electioneering? You see, we have heard every other kind of distraction about what the Auditor-General has done and what the rules might or might not mean, but Labour members have never answered that question. Well, I did a little investigation. I went back and looked at the launch of the Labour election campaign for 2005 by Helen Clark.

TischLindsay Tisch Link to this

What does it say?

EnglishHon BILL ENGLISH Link to this

Well, it was a campaign opening and a lengthy speech, and at the heart of that speech was the pledge card. Ms Clark said: “We pioneered pledge cards for our key commitments.” Well, I say that it also pioneered taxpayer funding of them. Then she said: “Now we are making fresh pledges on key policies …”. If that is not electioneering, then this is not Parliament. So that was Helen Clark’s view.

Well, what did Heather Simpson say to the police when they asked her whether that was electioneering? She said something completely different. The person who was running the Labour Party campaign said that as far as she was concerned, the purpose of those publications was the same in respect of previous similar publications by Labour—to inform the public of the position of the leader and the parliamentary team on the issues of the day. Then the police asked her whether she had followed the Electoral Act. That was a good question, because if that were electioneering, she had breached the Electoral Act. She said that her understanding of the Electoral Act was that it applied to elections, not to parliamentary business. So the Labour Party has lost the trust of the New Zealand public, because in just those two examples it has shown its willingness to argue completely opposite positions in respect of a critical aspect of the accountability and trust the public has in any Government, at all.

In fact, what has come through this debate is a fierce and ugly sense of entitlement on the part of Labour. It has a fierce and ugly sense of entitlement that it is able to do with taxpayers’ money whatever it likes, to serve its interests. I have illustrated to the House that the Prime Minister was able to get up in front of her campaign opening event and show the pledge card, and wave it around as a centrepiece of her electioneering, then her chief of staff told the New Zealand Police, our law enforcement agency, that that had nothing to do with the election. That is why the Labour Party is forfeiting the trust of the New Zealand people.

It is not new for Helen Clark; she has done it before. The police—tell them whatever one likes! Heather Simpson, who is fully paid on a public salary by this Parliament, is now an employee of a new fiction: the “Office of the Leader of the Parliamentary Labour Party”. I have had a look through public records, and such an office never existed until Helen Clark got into trouble as Prime Minister. Labour made it up to avoid accountability for someone who is paid $150,000 of public money, and who used that time and money to break the law.

I want to move to a probably more disturbing issue, which has not been canvassed extensively in this debate—that is, what happens now? Let us say that this legislation is passed. It does not alter a fact of history, which is that a Government—in this case, the Labour Government—overspent in its election campaign by half a million dollars, and possibly more, and got away with it. So what will happen next election? The police effectively said that it was too much of a constitutional disturbance to prosecute the Government because it had exceeded the electoral cap. They said that they could throw out an MP, but that they probably should not throw out a Government. This Parliament has now left a situation where the next Government could do the same.

What is there to stop Helen Clark from doing exactly the same, next election? Nothing! The police will not prosecute her because they are too scared to, and if she breaks the rules with taxpayers’ money, Parliament will pass legislation to validate it. So what is to stop Helen Clark overspending by a million dollars next time, to secure a historic fourth term? She, Heather Simpson, Michael Cullen, and Chris Carter will sit in the Beehive and say that they got away with it last time, and that they will get away with it again. It is that deep and ugly cynicism underlying this debate that I have found so distasteful, and that dishonours this Parliament. Labour has demonstrated that it will wilfully break the law. Its members will then use the privileges of power to bully, hassle, and discredit anyone who criticises them. If that does not work, they will use the privileges and power of this House to change the law and defend their position.

In that respect, I want to make some comments on the role of the Speaker. Parliament has, at its best, acted as a check on the executive, but in this case I am concerned that it has not. I was struck by the startling similarity of the Speaker’s report on the Auditor-General’s report, and the Labour Party’s arguments against his report. In fact, Dr Cullen’s arguments were rehearsed, word for word, by the Speaker. Instead of the Speaker doing what should have been done, which was to show deference and respect to the officers of this Parliament—because the Speaker is one—the Speaker rebutted, criticised, and discredited the Auditor-General, then used a slick and silly legal opinion to discredit the Solicitor-General. In fact, the legal opinion was so bad that it did not refer to any of the legal precedents in this matter, and if any student did that in a university legal exam, he or she would fail. The Speaker gave the appearance of being complicit in the Government’s attempt to muddy the waters over this issue. That is a stain on the Speakership, and this Speakership will not regain the credibility it ought to have. When it really mattered, Parliament let the people down.

RobertsonThe ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) Link to this

The member is going too far, and I ask the member to withdraw and apologise about the stain on the Speakership.

EnglishHon BILL ENGLISH Link to this

I want finally to return to—

RobertsonThe ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) Link to this

No, I asked the member to withdraw and apologise—

EnglishHon BILL ENGLISH Link to this

Oh, sorry—in what respect?

RobertsonThe ASSISTANT SPEAKER (H V Ross Robertson) Link to this

—in respect of the comments just made about the Speaker.

EnglishHon BILL ENGLISH Link to this

I withdraw and apologise, Mr Assistant Speaker.

Lastly, I want to deal with the issue where Labour claims that the Auditor-General has changed the definitions of parliamentary purposes. He has not, and he says he has not. He has not changed the definition of parliamentary expenditure. The whole argument that members cannot fly home or send out Christmas cards is absolute rubbish. Unfortunately, the Speaker has scared the Parliamentary Service Commission into making sure there is pre-approval. It is all rubbish; it is all a distraction. Labour has forfeited the right to the trust of the New Zealand people.

FinlaysonCHRISTOPHER FINLAYSON (National) Link to this

In December 1776 the great American revolutionary Thomas Paine published his pamphlet, The Crisis, which stated: “These are the times that try men’s souls … Tyranny, like hell, is not easily conquered;”. And I know how Tom must have felt, for these are indeed dark days for our democracy.

A few days ago a very important report by the Auditor-General on unauthorised expenditure was presented to this House. The Government ensured that no opportunity was given to debate that report, which I would have thought was in the public interest. Instead, the Government moved to introduce the Appropriation (Parliamentary Expenditure Validation) Bill and force it through all its stages, without giving the public the opportunity to make any submissions. I would have thought it was in the public interest that the public make submissions.

I have a number of objections to this bill as it has emerged from the Committee. First, it is unnecessary. Secondly, it is incomplete. Thirdly, it is odious. First, as to necessity, the bill, as we know, contains two parts. It validates expenditure under Vote Parliamentary Service for the last 13 years and allegedly clarifies rules on an interim basis until the end of 2007. Yet the validation goes beyond the appropriations found to be unlawful by the Auditor-General. Secondly, it is unnecessary to use legislation to change the rules in the interim—a point that has never been addressed by any Labour speaker in response.

I said in the Committee stage that the Auditor-General’s concerns arose from the Speaker’s directions issued under section 8 of the Parliamentary Service Act 2000, and the directions’ definitions of “parliamentary purposes” and “electioneering”. All that needs to happen is for new directions to be issued substituting new definitions. There is no need for clarification by legislation.

My second objection is that the bill is incomplete. Significantly, there is no obligation for miscreants to repay any unauthorised expenditure; nor are there any reporting requirements. That is why I moved a number of amendments to Part 2 of the bill during the Committee stage. Those amendments sought to introduce provisions ensuring that unauthorised expenditure would be repaid with interest and penalties if the sums outstanding were not repaid by 31 December. It is notable that although some members emphasised the moral commitment to pay, they were not prepared to support provisions that would have made that moral commitment a legal commitment. Those provisions would have gone some way to improving this bill, but Labour refused to debate them. It was not prepared to put up any speaker to justify why repayment and reporting provisions were not needed but validating provisions were.

My third objection is that the bill is odious. It does not comply with fundamental common law principles. In 2003 the Legislation Advisory Committee republished its guidelines on good legislation. Part 1 of section 2 asks a very important question: does the legislation in question comply with fundamental common law principles? Let us look at some of those principles. Does this bill satisfy the principle that the citizen is entitled to have access to the courts? Well, no, it does not. It will remove litigation rights in the Darnton case—and this is even before the litigation has been heard in the High Court. Secondly, there is the principle that everyone exercising public authority must act legally, reasonably, and honestly. This legislation grants one standard for the Labour Party and a much stricter standard for members of the public.

Thirdly, there is the principle of the rule of law that no one is above the law. Enough said. This law places politicians above the law, particularly Labour politicians and their cohorts. Finally, there is the principle that all are treated equally before the law. Again, enough said. There is one standard for the Labour Party and another standard for the general public. The rulers have rewritten the rules to place themselves in a superior and privileged position.

This bill does not comply with fundamental principles of the common law; nor, arguably, does it comply with the New Zealand Bill of Rights Act. The Attorney-General never condescended to prepare a report under Part 7 of the New Zealand Bill of Rights Act, but it is interesting that section 12 of that Act provides that every citizen has the right to vote in genuine elections—and “genuine” is a very important word. How can there be genuine elections in this country when a bill of this kind is introduced that legitimises breaches of the Public Finance Act and the Electoral Act?

What was it about the former Solicitor-General’s opinion, dated 19 April 2006, that Labour found so difficult, thus necessitating its obtaining a contrary opinion from Chapman Tripp—which I contend is an extraordinary thing to do, given that it was the Solicitor-General who gave the original advice? I refer to his opinion, where he set out a number of tests for determining whether expenditure was unauthorised. He said there was a bright-line approach, an apportionment test, or the dominant purpose test. But on any view of this matter, Labour’s unauthorised expenditure was outside the rules. And what was it about the Auditor-General’s actions that the Labour Party failed to understand? The Auditor-General spelt out the rules time and time again. I need not refer to his report, but he urged members of Parliament to be cautious even before the 2005 general election.

So there we have it: there is one rule for the Labour Party and another for the public, who are held to much higher standards. It is no wonder that this place is held in such low esteem. I myself was disappointed that other parties did not support my amendments. I did not expect the lost souls in the Labour Government to support them, but I had hoped the Green and United Future MPs at least would have considered the amendments. Those amendments would have enabled all MPs to regain some respect in the eyes of the public.

Mr Harawira, in his excellent second reading speech, commented that all members of Parliament are privileged men and women. Those in public life have been given much by the people of New Zealand. But of those to whom much is given, much is expected, and at the end of our time in this place, whether we are to be regarded as successful or as failures depends on whether we are seen as people who have integrity—on whether we are people who are seen to be dedicated to serving the public good and the interests of all New Zealanders. This legislation does not serve the public good. It does not serve New Zealand’s interests.

It is not a question of inadvertently sinning, as was alleged by the member for Waimakariri. By the way, what is inadvertent sinning? It is an oxymoron, just like the Labour Party. In order to sin one has to do wrong. One cannot inadvertently sin. It has to be deliberate, just like Labour’s actions. But instead of confessing, asking for forgiveness, and repenting, Labour has urgently legislated immediate absolution for itself.

The Government’s actions have been opposed throughout all stages of this bill by the National Party, the Māori Party, and ACT. That opposition continues through this third reading. National will fail to prevent the passage of the bill this afternoon, but we will succeed in the end. I can assure the House that I, for one, and, I am sure, my National colleagues, will be zealous to ensure that any party that has not repaid any unauthorised expenditure will be held to account—perhaps not this afternoon, but one day, for sure. I can promise those people that justice will prevail.

Link to this

A party vote was called for on the question,

That the Appropriation (Parliamentary Expenditure Validation) Bill be now read a third time.

Ayes 61

Noes 50

Abstentions 6

Bill read a third time.

Speeches

Oct 2006
Mon Tue Wed Thu Fri
23456
910111213
1617181920
2324252627
3031123