7. Hon Dr NICK SMITH (National—Nelson) Link to this
to the Minister of Energy
How does he reconcile his statement to the House last Wednesday, “We have not grown our coal-fired power”, with the official Government figures showing an increase from 1,533 GWh in 2000, or 4 percent of New Zealand’s power, to 5,119 GWh in 2006, or 12 percent of New Zealand’s power, and with the Government’s goal of carbon neutrality?
Hon TREVOR MALLARD (Minister for Economic Development) Link to this
I will answer on behalf of the Minister of Energy and the Minister responsible for Climate Change Issues, who is currently opening yet another wind farm. No new coal-fired generation has been built in the term of this Labour-led Government. The rise in generation is because of cheap Māui gas running out and the Huntly power station switching from using primarily gas to using primarily coal. But I am pleased to inform the House that last year less coal was burnt for generation than in the year prior to that. This trend will continue because of the recent commissioning of Huntly E3P Power Station and substantial renewable investments by both State-owned enterprises and Contact Energy.
Hon Dr Nick Smith Link to this
How can the expanded use of coal under this Government—seven times that of new wind energy—be consistent with the Government’s goal of carbon neutrality, when coal is the dirtiest form of energy and the single-largest global source of greenhouse gases?
Hon TREVOR MALLARD Link to this
Some people can tell the difference between capacity and generation. If people had been brighter in the past and we had all understood the importance of climate change 20, 30, or 40 years ago—
Hon Dr Michael CullenHon TREVOR MALLARD Link to this
—or even 10 years ago, then we would not be in this situation. I am not prepared to do what that member suggests, which is to shut down the power station and have Kiwis go cold at night. That is what that member wants.
Dave HereoraHon TREVOR MALLARD Link to this
As it happens, I have. I have also seen a report that Nicky Wagner supports carbon neutrality.
Hon TREVOR MALLARD Link to this
I have seen a report that Nicky Wagner supports carbon neutrality. I have seen reports that Nick Smith wants to get out of the Kyoto Protocol at the first opportunity. I have seen reports that John Key wants to stay in Kyoto, but I have seen a report that states that John Key thinks it is all a hoax. I have seen a report that the National Party’s spokesperson on energy is bullish on the future role of fossil fuels, and all I can say is that the National Party at some time is going to have to say what its policy is rather than going around emitting a whole pile of methane.
Jeanette Fitzsimons Link to this
If Governments during the 1990s had taken the repeated advice of many energy analysts, who urged them to renegotiate the Māui gas agreements to allow a slower depletion rate and a longer lifetime for the field through more efficient use of the gas, would we be burning as much coal at Huntly as we currently are?
Hon TREVOR MALLARD Link to this
That is a really interesting question, and I think the answer is probably not. But there are some other factors involved, such as whether Methanex would have kept going for longer under that sort of arrangement if the gas was available for longer, and on the balance of the different sorts of fossil fuels it is very hard to say what would have happened. But certainly the National Party has to take a lot of responsibility for the fact that we are running out of gas.
Hon Dr Nick Smith Link to this
Seeing that the Minister has challenged National about its ideas on climate change, I seek leave to table our paper A Bluegreen Vision for New Zealand.
Madam SPEAKERHon Dr Nick Smith Link to this
How does the Government’s decision to spend $3.4 million on a brand new 8 megawatt coal burner at the Waiōuru Military Camp that, over its 30-year life, will emit one million tonnes of carbon dioxide sit with the Government’s policy of a carbon neutral Public Service?
Hon TREVOR MALLARD Link to this
I know that that member prefers cold soldiers. We prefer them to have reliable energy and that means, of course, that we will have to make other savings within the Public Service.
Hon Dr Nick Smith Link to this
Is the Minister aware that the army’s new coal-fired boiler will emit 100 times as much carbon dioxide as the Ministry for the Environment will save by going carbon neutral, and does that not show the shallowness of the Government having a handful of paper-pushing departments going carbon neutral while the real sources of carbon are ignored?
Hon TREVOR MALLARD Link to this
Not only the Public Service but the State sector is going in that direction. It will take time and it will—
Hon Bill EnglishHon TREVOR MALLARD Link to this
Well, I know the difference, even if the member does not. After having been a Minister for 6 or 9 years, Bill English is showing his ignorance again. It is a challenge and this Government is up to it, but the Opposition does not care.
Hon Dr Nick Smith Link to this
How can the Minister say that the Government is heading in the right direction, when that one new coal burner, which started to operate this week, will emit more carbon each year than all the Government departments that are proposed to be carbon neutral by 2012 will save—in fact, it will be 60 times the amount of emissions saved by the idea of the Government’s VIP fleet going to more efficient cars—and is it not true that the Government is trying to catch mice while forgetting about the elephants of climate change?
Hon TREVOR MALLARD Link to this
We can see mice, and we can see a rat as well. This just shows to Parliament the fact that as a country we have an enormous challenge. It takes time to implement policies like this, and I for one am not prepared to go to Waiōuru and tell the soldiers that we do not care whether they freeze.
Hon Dr Nick Smith Link to this
I seek leave to table the documents in respect of the new boiler at Waiōuru, where there were alternatives of both wood-generated—
Hon TREVOR MALLARD Link to this
I seek leave to table the Petroleum Exploration and Production Association of New Zealand weekly report of 10 August 2007, where it states that Gerry Brownlee was quite bullish about the role for fossil fuels—