9. Hon Dr NICK SMITH (National—Nelson) Link to this
to the Minister of Energy
Why is the Government proceeding with a mandatory biofuels obligation in fuels from 1 July 2008, when the Parliamentary Commissioner for the Environment said that importing biofuels risks damaging our clean green image and that the Biofuel Bill should not proceed?
Hon DAVID PARKER (Minister of Energy) Link to this
The biofuels obligation is for a modest one half of 1 percent of land transport fuel in the first year. The Parliamentary Commissioner for the Environment is, of course, right to be concerned about sustainability issues, but, like the Greens, I believe we can avoid importing unsustainable biofuels.
Hon Dr Nick Smith Link to this
How does this make any environmental sense, when the Minister has agreed with oil companies that ethanol is likely to be imported from Brazil to meet that biofuels obligation, and when the lead story in Time magazine this week details how the very importation of that ethanol is leading to the mass destruction of the Amazon forest, to which the story concludes: “biofuels aren’t part of the solution at all. They're part of the problem.”?
I disagree that some biofuels are not part of the solution—they are and will be. In respect of the economics of different biofuel sources in New Zealand, bio-diesel is cheaper than bio-ethanol in general.
Su’a William SioWhat evidence does the Minister have of support for the mandatory biofuels obligation from New Zealand companies?
BioDiesel Oils (NZ) Ltd has been making bio-diesel since 1999. That company is currently building a second multibillion-dollar tallow to bio-diesel factory with a capacity of 60 million litres per annum. Additionally, a Solid Energy subsidiary has oilseed rape planted, which it expects will produce more than 10 million litres of bio-diesel after the 2009 harvest. Both of these are more than enough to meet the obligation. These are two examples of companies investing on the basis of this Government’s sound sustainability policies, and although National claims to be in favour of both innovative business and sustainability, Dr Smith’s comments again reveal that National is all talk and opposes all meaningful steps.
Hon Dr Nick Smith Link to this
Does the Government agree with the United Nations food agency, which said in February that biofuels are a “crime against humanity”, and with the UK’s chief scientist, who said last month that biofuels obligations are a threat to the lives of hundreds of millions of people?
Both the Greens and the Labour-led Government have always been aware that some biofuels are not sustainable, but that does not mean that all biofuels are not sustainable.
Hon Dr Nick Smith Link to this
Does the Minister stand by his statement to this House that “most biofuels are likely to come from South America to meet the obligation”, and his further statement to the New Zealand Herald that we are likely to have unsustainable biofuels in the short term; and can he explain to the House how that might help the environment?
I repeat what I said in my answer to the primary question, which was a repetition of prior answers in this House. I believe we can avoid importing unsustainable biofuels. Further, I read a press release from BioDiesel Oils (NZ) Ltd, which states: “Dr Nick Smith has stated publicly that New Zealand is not ready to meet the July 1 target with a local sustainable product, such as tallow. This is clearly not correct.”
Hon Dr Nick Smith Link to this
I raise a point of order, Madam Speaker. I asked the Minister whether he stood by his statement to the House that “most biofuels are likely to come from South America to meet the biofuels obligation.” He did not address that in his answer.
Madam SPEAKERHe did not address it in a way the member found to his satisfaction, but he did actually address the question by referring to a previous answer he had given—in effect the same answer. [ Interruption] I can see that my ruling has had absolutely no notice taken of it by members.
Jeanette Fitzsimons Link to this
Does the Minister see any difference between biofuels made in New Zealand from largely waste materials or low-value by-products and biofuels such as those from the US corn-to-ethanol programme, or from soya beans, or from palm oil, which is destroying rain forests; if so, can he confirm that all the examples that Nick Smith has referred to will be illegal under New Zealand’s legislation?
Indeed, that is the very purpose of sustainability standards around bio-diesel. I return to the somewhat simplistic proposition that the member Dr Smith is making that suggests that all biofuels are unsustainable just because some are.
Hon Dr Nick Smith Link to this
Will the Minister guarantee to the House that New Zealand will not be importing biofuels from Brazil; if so, how is that consistent with his statement that “most biofuels are likely to come from South America”, which he told the House 2 weeks ago?
No, I will not give that guarantee, because I have absolutely no doubt that some of the biofuels that are produced in Brazil are from sustainable sources.
Hon Dr Nick Smith Link to this
Does the Minister agree with New Zealand’s longest-serving Minister for the Environment, Simon Upton, who said that “the road to hell is paved with biofuels.”, and the report that he co-authored with the OECD, which concludes that the cure of biofuels—
Gerry BrownleeI am sorry, I didn’t hear the interjection, but I could quite clearly hear. If the member took offence then the answer is to take offence, not to start reading the question again. This is the purpose of having the rules.
Hon Dr Nick Smith Link to this
My question to the Minister is whether he agrees with New Zealand’s longest-serving former Minister for the Environment, Simon Upton, that “the road to hell is paved with biofuels”, and the report he co-authored with the OECD, which concluded that the cure of biofuels is actually worse than the disease?
I agree that a range of technologies will be needed as we make the transition over the decades to come from oil to other sources of fuel for transport. I think that I have been one of those first on record to say that it is more likely that a substantial proportion of that substitution will come from electricity rather than from bio-diesel, and that is why the Government is leading on that front. Nevertheless, part of the answer lies in sustainable biofuels.
Hon Dr Nick Smith Link to this
I seek leave of the House to table the OECD Round Table report on sustainability saying that biofuels are a cure worse than the disease.
Hon Dr Nick Smith Link to this
I seek leave to table “The Clean Energy Myth” lead story in Time magazine showing the unsustainability of biofuels—
Rt Hon Winston Peters Link to this
Can the Minister confirm that it is the same Simon Upton who signed up to the Kyoto Protocol, despite Mr Key now saying that global warming does not exist, and who supported Max Bradford’s electricity reforms to plateau out costs, only to see them go straight through the roof—is that the same Simon Upton that that member was talking about?
Yes it is, and I would also note that Simon Upton has been consistent in his support of the need to take meaningful steps to reduce greenhouse gas emissions. He supports the emissions trading scheme and is not as slippery on these issues as National.
Hon Dr Nick Smith Link to this
I seek leave to table the piece written by Simon Upton saying “the road to hell is paved with biofuels”.