6. Hon DAVID CUNLIFFE (Labour—New Lynn) Link to this
to the Minister of Finance
Does he agree with the Prime Minister that “we do not believe that any Government programme will be able to prevent a significant rise in unemployment”?
Hon BILL ENGLISH (Minister of Finance) Link to this
Yes, but alongside that the Government has introduced a rolling maul of programmes to assist people, where possible, with unemployment.
Hon David Cunliffe Link to this
How can the Minister maintain that view when the OECD has credited Australia’s fiscal stimulus with having saved up to 200,000 jobs?
We believe that the fiscal stimulus in New Zealand has saved thousands of jobs, as well. In any case, the Australian economy was in a better position to start with, because for the last 10 years it has been managed well, whereas ours has been managed badly.
Amy AdamsFor New Zealand, the forecasts are showing that unemployment may peak lower than the 8 percent that was estimated in the Budget. Compared with many other countries, such as the UK, the US, and most of Europe, our unemployment is low. In fact, only a handful of developed countries, such as Australia, have a similar or lower level of unemployment.
Hon David Cunliffe Link to this
Does he agree with the Secretary-General of the OECD, who said: “Employment is the bottom line in the current crisis,”; if so, why does he not do more earlier to prevent New Zealand’s unemployment rising, as Australia has done—holding unemployment steady for 3 consecutive months?
I do agree with the OECD Secretary-General that unemployment is No. 1, and I wish that Labour did too, because then it would understand the decisions that were made about the emissions trading scheme, which will help keep thousands of jobs in New Zealand that would otherwise be exported to China.
Of course, New Zealand has had a combination of its own recession, starting at the beginning of 2008, followed by the global recession. Compared with other recessions, it looks as if New Zealand is now reaping the benefits of being an open and resilient economy, because unemployment is forecast to peak somewhere between 7.5 and 8 percent, whereas in previous recessions it has reached over 10 percent. That is a huge benefit to the thousands of New Zealanders who will keep their jobs instead of losing them.
Hon David Cunliffe Link to this
Can the Minister confirm that he said on Radio New Zealand today that “for most people the measure of the economy is whether unemployment is still rising”, and, given that it is, does he not now regret doing so little to keep Kiwis in jobs and prevent the erosion of living standards in families?
No. What I do regret is that through some of the best economic conditions that the globe will see in a generation, that member’s party wasted the opportunity and thousands of people have lost their jobs.
Hon David Cunliffe Link to this
I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. I imagine you can anticipate the point of order, Mr Speaker, but every time that Minister is under pressure in an answer he resorts to quoting history and reciting Labour Party policy—or at least his version of it. Is there no way you can encourage him to talk about his Government, rather than make up stories about somebody else’s?
Mr SPEAKERThe honourable member might recollect that when his leader asked a straight question, I sought and he got an answer from the Minister. The member may recollect that in his own question he asked whether the Minister regretted something. When a member puts that kind of part into a question it invites all kinds of answers, because it is seeking an opinion—whether the Minister regrets that bit or regrets something else. I cannot pin the Minister down on that kind of question. I invite the member to reflect on the question that his leader asked and on the question he asked, and I think he will see a difference.
Hon David Cunliffe Link to this
I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. I seek your guidance in interpreting your learned remarks made previously. In my supplementary question I simply quoted the Minister’s own words and asked whether, in the context of his answer, he now regretted them, as they seemed to contradict his former point. How can that be grounds for him to depart from talking about his own Government and spend the whole of his reply talking about Labour?
Because, very clearly, to ask whether the Minister regrets some remarks is to seek an opinion. Once the member invites the Minister to give an opinion, it is far more difficult to be precise with answers.
I think the member needs only to look at Speakers’ Rulings to see all the rulings around opinions, and it is difficult. It is difficult for the Speaker to ask a Minister to answer more precisely when an opinion has been sought, because often the opinion will not be what the member wanted.
Hon Jim AndertonWhen the Minister of Finance claims credit for a low level of unemployment in New Zealand, does he believe that that low level of unemployment has happened in just the last few months, or was there a low level of unemployment relative to all other OECD countries for almost the whole 9 years of the previous Labour-led Government?
Opposition members need to decide whether they are attacking the Government for unemployment being low, as that member was, or for unemployment being high, as the previous questioner was. The facts are pretty straightforward. We went into this recession with relatively low unemployment, and it will peak significantly lower than for other countries and significantly lower than in other recessions.