Minimum Wage Review—Submission

Does the Minister understand that Māori workers will feel short-changed by the $3.78 per week increase, and by the fact that the Prime Minister, John Key, has confirmed that the Māori Party was told of the decision after it was made—hardly a mana-enhancing process?

I am not sure which part of the question I should answer.

Hon Members

All of it!

OK. My submission was for an increase in the basic wage to $15 an hour, incrementally—in two steps. Of course I understand the value of the minimum wage. If there is an increase, it gives an incentive for Māori to stay in employment.

I therefore suggest and remind that Minister—

Hon Gerry Brownlee Link to this

Order!

I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker.

I do not think I need to hear the point of order. The member will resume his seat. He should remember that he is no longer a Minister. He does not suggest; he asks questions.

Flavell Te Ururoa Flavell Link to this

Would the Minister agree with me that the last time the National Party was in Government it took the minimum wage up 86c over 9 years, and that the previous Labour Government took the minimum wage up nine times?

I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. The Māori Party is interested in this sort of discussion, but I did not actually hear the question. Could you ask the member to repeat the question, please?

If members did not hear it, I am prepared to ask the honourable member to repeat it so that all members can hear it.

Hone Harawira Link to this

Does the Minister appreciate that the last time National was in Government it took the minimum wage up by 86c over 9 years, and the previous Labour Government took it up nine times—

I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. That was not the question that he asked the first time.

Hon Gerry Brownlee Link to this

The member will resume his seat. I must say to members that I am very impressed that Hone Harawira could determine that, because I could not. It was very difficult for me to hear the first version of the question, and therefore it is extraordinarily difficult for me to rule on it. I would ask the Minister, if he is prepared to answer the question, to please answer it.

I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. If you reflect on that question, you will find that the Minister has absolutely no responsibility for any matters raised in that sort of question.

Cullen Hon Dr Michael Cullen Link to this

In the interests of fairness I am prepared to allow the member to rephrase his question. But I would point out that Ministers have a custodial responsibility for factual information about their departments’ activities that go beyond the current Government’s term, but they have no responsibility for policies of another party. In the interests of fairness I am prepared to allow the honourable member the chance to ask his question and—

I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. I just seek some clarification of that last point. Clearly, the Minister has no responsibility for another party’s policies, but factual information about what happened under a previous Government is a somewhat different matter, I would suggest.

As I understand the member’s point of order, that is correct. Factual information about what transpired under a previous Government is material that the current Minister has custodial information about, but he is not responsible for another party’s policies. I invite the honourable member to ask the question. Given the confusion, in fairness I think he should have a chance to ask his question.

Does the Minister agree that the previous National Government took the minimum wage up by 86c over a period of 9 long years, and that the previous Labour Government took it up nine times, and is the Minister prepared to say what effect that will have on Māori workers?

The member has asked for information going back a couple of Governments ago. I do not think he can expect the current Minister to have that information at his fingertips. It goes back beyond the 9 years of the previous Labour Government, as I understood the member’s question. I do not see how he can expect the current Minister to have information going back as far as that. In the interests of fairness to the member, I will give him one more chance to ask a question, but I make it clear—

I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. I am happy to answer the question.

If the Minister feels comfortable answering the question, I will allow him to do so.

Cullen Hon Dr Michael Cullen Link to this

My answer is no and no.

I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. Do we take from that answer that the Minister made a submission on the minimum wage in complete ignorance of—

Flavell Te Ururoa Flavell Link to this

The member knows, as one who is most knowledgable about the Standing Orders, that that is not a point of order, and it is not appreciated when he raises that kind of point of order.

Tēnā koe, Mr Speaker. Kia ora tātou. Is the Minister concerned that after 9 years of a Labour Government the Māori unemployment rate, which is 9.6 percent, is over twice as high as the general unemployment rate? How does he think lifting the minimum wage will change this?

Yes, I am concerned, and our commitment is to lift the minimum wage, and to ensure that there is sufficient incentive for Māori to stay in the Labour market and not to opt out.

Does the Minister agree that when the previous Labour Government came in the unemployment rate was running generally at 21.2 percent, and that the previous Labour Government brought unemployment down to 4 percent for the mainstream and 7 percent for Māori, and also kept Māori in the workforce a lot more than any other people?

I stress that that question is getting a fair way away from the primary question.

Hone Harawira Link to this

Unfortunately, it still is a high rate for under-24-year-olds at this time—18 percent.

Tēnā koe, Mr Speaker. Why did you make a submission to the Minister of Labour to advocate for lifting the minimum wage to $15 an hour?

Mallard Hon Trevor Mallard Link to this

I raise a point of order, Mr Speaker. Although I am sure you do lots of things, I doubt very much that you made a submission to the Minister of Labour.

Mallard Hon Trevor Mallard Link to this

I appreciate the honourable member’s concern, but interrupting a question is—

Mr Speaker, you made it clear last year, as a result of a submission by the Hon Bill English, that you would be strict about this matter. I think it applies to Government members and their—what are they called-supporters, as well as to Labour members.

Hone Harawira Link to this

I accept the member’s point. I invite the honourable member to state his question again so that the Minister can hear it afresh.

My apologies, Mr Speaker. Why did the Minister of Māori Affairs make a submission to the Minister of Labour to advocate lifting the minimum wage to $15 an hour?