6. CATHERINE DELAHUNTY (Green) Link to this
to the Minister for Social Development and Employment
How will the objectives of the Welfare Working Group protect the needs of New Zealand’s most vulnerable citizens?
Hon PAULA BENNETT (Minister for Social Development and Employment) Link to this
The terms of reference have been carefully developed to tackle the really hard issues of long-term dependency. I think that helps our most vulnerable—our children.
Catherine Delahunty Link to this
Is it an objective of the Welfare Working Group to promote the idea that there is a link between “low average intelligence and low class position”; if not, why has she appointed Peter Saunders, who espouses this view, as an adviser to the group?
Hon PAULA BENNETT Link to this
He is one of many advisers, both international and domestic, who have a whole range of views and will be talking to the Welfare Working Group. I have not heard that view previously; it is only one of many.
Carmel SepuloniDoes she believe that the availability of the domestic purposes benefit makes single parenthood attractive and a lifestyle choice, as Peter Saunders, one of her social welfare working-group advisers, has claimed; and was it the reason why she availed herself of the benefit system in New Zealand?
Hon PAULA BENNETT Link to this
Personal insults aside, I say that Peter Saunders is one of many advisers. He has something to offer the group as far as international knowledge is concerned. Members can read his book Welfare to Work, which he wrote in Australia. I do not agree with everything he said; I do not agree with everything that a number of the advisers to the group said. But we are open to listening to those views from the Welfare Working Group.
Catherine Delahunty Link to this
Is it an objective of the Welfare Working Group to promote a “competitive market for sickness, invalid, and unemployment insurance.”; if not, why has she appointed to the group Catherine Isaac, who endorsed this policy as former president of the ACT Party?
Hon PAULA BENNETT Link to this
There are a range of views on the Welfare Working Group, and a range of advisers is coming in and talking to the group. We are actually holding a conference that will have a number of other people involved, including Susan St John, who was invited to be on the Welfare Working Group but has decided that she would instead like to be involved in the same way that she was with the Tax Working Group. Disability groups would like to be involved. There is a range of views, none of which we are actually jumping on to sides with.
Catherine Delahunty Link to this
Is it an objective of the Welfare Working Group to use the welfare system to benefit private interests; if not, why has she appointed Adrian Roberts, who is a contractor to Work and Income, to the group?
Hon PAULA BENNETT Link to this
He brings to the table another view and other areas of interest. A range of views is coming from different directions. [ Interruption] Well, there actually is a range of views. Some are with Māori organisations that have been working with those who are welfare-dependent for long periods of time, and have been making significant differences in getting them off welfare. We also have some others. So there are a number of different initiatives, and I think they are equally worth listening to.
Mr SPEAKERBefore I ask Catherine Delahunty to ask a further supplementary question, I ask members to please keep the interjections down to a reasonable level. I cannot hear the Minister’s answers, and it is important that I do hear them. I call Catherine Delahunty.
Catherine Delahunty Link to this
Does she consider people with disabilities to be among our most vulnerable citizens; if so, why has she not appointed anyone with an actual disability to the group, as opposed to just representing the care sector?
Hon PAULA BENNETT Link to this
One of the academics on the group has a strong interest in disability issues, and she is presenting that interest. Those from the sector will have an opportunity to advise the group as well.
Catherine Delahunty Link to this
Given these appointments, did she really have New Zealand’s most vulnerable citizens in mind when she chose the members and advisers of the Welfare Working Group?
Hon PAULA BENNETT Link to this
Every bit of evidence tells us that children who grow up in a household that is not dependent on welfare do better, and I and this Government have them in mind when we look at what we can do for them in the longer term.
Catherine Delahunty Link to this
How can vulnerable New Zealanders possibly be best served by a group whose advisers and members think that those New Zealanders are inherently less intelligent, lower-class lifestyle beneficiaries whose painful personal situations are an opportunity for private profit?
Hon PAULA BENNETT Link to this
The member is taking a quote from one adviser—one of many views that are coming to the welfare group, some of which I do not agree with. As I say, I agree with some points of view that are put forward, and I do not agree with others. But those very members of society who are dependent on welfare have been ignored for 10 years. They have had money thrown at them, yet we have seen welfare numbers increasing. Those vulnerable members of society whom the member mentions are actually worse off now than they were 10 years ago. We will address the complex issues, and I make no apologies for that.